Discussion:
S08E11 Dark Water
Add Reply
Agamemnon
2014-11-01 22:32:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
New Master... don't like her.

So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.

Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?

Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.

The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.

So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?

I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?

Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?

Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.

10/10
Your Name
2014-11-01 23:15:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
In article <***@eclipse.net.uk>, Agamemnon
<***@hello.to.NO_SPAM> wrote:
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Agamemnon
2014-11-01 23:50:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
So where did the soldier in the barn window in Gallifrey come from?

Did the Doctor ever have a memory of it?
Your Name
2014-11-02 00:38:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
So where did the soldier in the barn window in Gallifrey come from?
Did the Doctor ever have a memory of it?
The Doctor has memories of lots of things that were changed ... the
most obvious being that he destroyed Gallifrey with the
Rose-bomb-device.
TB
2014-11-02 02:05:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the car accident?
Pudentame
2014-11-02 03:38:34 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".

He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:06:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".
He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
Explain Orson.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Pudentame
2014-11-02 20:31:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".
He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
Explain Orson.
I don't have to explain Orson. Orson is far enough in Clara's possible
futures that there could be any number of reasons why he's linked to
Clara.

And another thing I've thought of in the meantime ...

How is Danny Pink's current situation materially different from Donna
Noble's or the "4022 saved" or River Song & her archeological team
at the Library during Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead?

The idea of human minds being uploaded into computers at the moment of
death is a Sci-Fi staple of long standing.

Another is the idea of making backup copies of human minds to be
downloaded into a new body as a kind of extreme "life" insurance.
Your Name
2014-11-02 20:45:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into
a Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in
the future earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained
next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the
car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".
He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
Explain Orson.
I don't have to explain Orson. Orson is far enough in Clara's possible
futures that there could be any number of reasons why he's linked to
Clara.
<snip>

The "magic trees" episode played here in New Zealand last night. In
that there is a scene where the Doctor says the Earth is going to be
destroyed by the solar flare. Clara asks how that can be since they
have seen the future Earth in their travels. The Doctor says that the
future is about to be changed.

Obviously he got that particular time wrong, but it shows that, as I
said above and as the Doctor has said a few times (and as Yoda said),
the future is not set in stone, and can be changed. The exception are
the "key events" which cannot be changed, but in some cases can be
moved (for example Rose's father dying).
Daniel47@teranews.com
2014-11-03 09:45:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 03/11/14 07:45, Your Name wrote:

<Snip>
Post by Your Name
Obviously he got that particular time wrong, but it shows that, as I
said above and as the Doctor has said a few times (and as Yoda said),
the future is not set in stone, and can be changed. The exception are
the "key events" which cannot be changed, but in some cases can be
moved (for example Rose's father dying).
Wasn't "The Waters of Mars" such a "key event" as well??

And The Doctor changed that!!

Daniel
Siri Crews
2014-11-02 20:35:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
How is Danny Pink's current situation materially different from Donna
Noble's or the "4022 saved" or River Song & her archeological team
at the Library during Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead?
[ ] Universe threatenning season finale.
[x] World threatenning season finale.
[ ] Resurrected Daleks.
[x] Resurrected Timelords.
[x] Resurrected Cybermen.
[x] Resurrected Master.

http://www.redbubble.com/people/inkandstardust/works/8583132-london-2012-been-the
re-done-that-went-in-the-tardis

Though I have better finale music for the Cyberman march.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=q3yEDLSOKYI#t=66
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'
Icke's razor: Given two equally plausible explanations, choose the weirder.
Defenders of Anarchy.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 21:52:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".
He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
Explain Orson.
I don't have to explain Orson. Orson is far enough in Clara's possible
futures that there could be any number of reasons why he's linked to
Clara.
And another thing I've thought of in the meantime ...
How is Danny Pink's current situation materially different from Donna
Noble's or the "4022 saved" or River Song & her archeological team
at the Library during Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead?
The idea of human minds being uploaded into computers at the moment of
death is a Sci-Fi staple of long standing.
Another is the idea of making backup copies of human minds to be
downloaded into a new body as a kind of extreme "life" insurance.
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring
would have Orson.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Pudentame
2014-11-03 00:01:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 21:52:19 +0000 (UTC), The Doctor
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".
He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
Explain Orson.
I don't have to explain Orson. Orson is far enough in Clara's possible
futures that there could be any number of reasons why he's linked to
Clara.
And another thing I've thought of in the meantime ...
How is Danny Pink's current situation materially different from Donna
Noble's or the "4022 saved" or River Song & her archeological team
at the Library during Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead?
The idea of human minds being uploaded into computers at the moment of
death is a Sci-Fi staple of long standing.
Another is the idea of making backup copies of human minds to be
downloaded into a new body as a kind of extreme "life" insurance.
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring
would have Orson.
Orson's great-grandmother was a time-traveler. Everyone assumes it
must be Clara, and because Orson looks like Danny, everyone assumes
his great-grandfather. But it's nowhere explicitly stated that I'm
aware of.
Your Name
2014-11-03 00:19:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 21:52:19 +0000 (UTC), The Doctor
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned
into a Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed
descendent in the future earlier in the series. Hopefully it will
all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the
car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".
He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
Explain Orson.
I don't have to explain Orson. Orson is far enough in Clara's possible
futures that there could be any number of reasons why he's linked to
Clara.
And another thing I've thought of in the meantime ...
How is Danny Pink's current situation materially different from Donna
Noble's or the "4022 saved" or River Song & her archeological team
at the Library during Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead?
The idea of human minds being uploaded into computers at the moment of
death is a Sci-Fi staple of long standing.
Another is the idea of making backup copies of human minds to be
downloaded into a new body as a kind of extreme "life" insurance.
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring
would have Orson.
Orson's great-grandmother was a time-traveler. Everyone assumes it
must be Clara, and because Orson looks like Danny, everyone assumes
his great-grandfather. But it's nowhere explicitly stated that I'm
aware of.
Yep. There were a lot of assumptions people made from that episode
(partly from Orson looking the same, partly from his rather vague
wording, and partly from the toy soldier) ... but from past experience
we've seen those "obvious assumptions" can often actually be purposely
created misdirections or simply meaningless filler.
The Doctor
2014-11-03 00:32:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by Pudentame
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 21:52:19 +0000 (UTC), The Doctor
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
Post by Your Name
<snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned
into a Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed
descendent in the future earlier in the series. Hopefully it will
all be explained next week.
The future is never set in stone and it can sometimes be changed.
Then why wasn't the Doctor willing to simply go back in time to undo the
car accident?
Same reason he wouldn't do it for Rose in "Father's Day".
He says something to Clara during the dream sequence about he knows
what he can change and what he can't.
Explain Orson.
I don't have to explain Orson. Orson is far enough in Clara's possible
futures that there could be any number of reasons why he's linked to
Clara.
And another thing I've thought of in the meantime ...
How is Danny Pink's current situation materially different from Donna
Noble's or the "4022 saved" or River Song & her archeological team
at the Library during Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead?
The idea of human minds being uploaded into computers at the moment of
death is a Sci-Fi staple of long standing.
Another is the idea of making backup copies of human minds to be
downloaded into a new body as a kind of extreme "life" insurance.
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring
would have Orson.
Orson's great-grandmother was a time-traveler. Everyone assumes it
must be Clara, and because Orson looks like Danny, everyone assumes
his great-grandfather. But it's nowhere explicitly stated that I'm
aware of.
Yep. There were a lot of assumptions people made from that episode
(partly from Orson looking the same, partly from his rather vague
wording, and partly from the toy soldier) ... but from past experience
we've seen those "obvious assumptions" can often actually be purposely
created misdirections or simply meaningless filler.
Or clue in by deuction.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
solar penguin
2014-11-04 11:43:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring would have Orson.
Why wait for them to marry? Maybe she's already pregnant with Danny's
child.

That could be what the "I love you" phone call at the beginning was all
about: she was preparing to tell him about hre pregnancy.
Siri Crews
2014-11-04 11:50:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by solar penguin
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring would have Orson.
Why wait for them to marry? Maybe she's already pregnant with Danny's
child.
That could be what the "I love you" phone call at the beginning was all
about: she was preparing to tell him about hre pregnancy.
What about Danny's twin brother separated at the orphanage?
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'
Icke's razor: Given two equally plausible explanations, choose the weirder.
Defenders of Anarchy.
p***@conservation.org
2014-11-04 21:32:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by solar penguin
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring would have Orson.
Why wait for them to marry? Maybe she's already pregnant with Danny's
child.
Though I suggested myself that she's already pregnant, the fact that Clara's descendants use the surname 'Pink' does suggest she would have married Danny.
Your Name
2014-11-05 00:16:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by solar penguin
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring would have Orson.
Why wait for them to marry? Maybe she's already pregnant with Danny's
child.
Though I suggested myself that she's already pregnant, the fact that Clara's
descendants use the surname 'Pink' does suggest she would have married Danny.
There was only ever a vague hint that Orson *might* be related to
Clara, one that could well have been misdirection on purpose. Maybe
Orson turns out to be cyber-Danny.
Your Name
2014-11-05 00:19:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by solar penguin
I thought Dany and Clara married and their offspring would have Orson.
Why wait for them to marry? Maybe she's already pregnant with Danny's
child.
Though I suggested myself that she's already pregnant, the fact that Clara's
descendants use the surname 'Pink' does suggest she would have married Danny.
There was only ever a vague hint that Orson *might* be related to
Clara, one that could well have been misdirection on purpose. Maybe
Orson turns out to be cyber-Danny.
Plus of course the fact that some things in time do change. So even
though the possibly-related Orson existed in one storyline, doesn't
mean another storyline can't alter the future and he no longer exists.
The Doctor
2014-11-01 23:53:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
I will join you in a moment.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
p***@conservation.org
2014-11-02 00:48:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Not to mention, how did the Master get access to all the people we saw die earlier in the series?
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series.
Clara and Danny haven't been going out that long - it's entirely possible she could be pregnant but not visibly so, so a living Danny would no longer be required.

Hopefully it will all be explained next week.

Well, that will be the only reason to keep watching, since it was a pretty tedious episode.
TB
2014-11-02 02:09:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Not to mention, how did the Master get access to all the people we saw die earlier in the series?
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series.
Clara and Danny haven't been going out that long - it's entirely possible she could be pregnant but not visibly so, so a living Danny would no longer be required.
In which episodes have they been seen boinking each other silly?
p***@conservation.org
2014-11-03 18:50:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Not to mention, how did the Master get access to all the people we saw die earlier in the series?
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series.
Clara and Danny haven't been going out that long - it's entirely possible she could be pregnant but not visibly so, so a living Danny would no longer be required.
In which episodes have they been seen boinking each other silly?
In what episodes were Rory and Amy seen doing so? Yet River Song existed regardless.
Ryan P.
2014-11-04 21:49:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by TB
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Not to mention, how did the Master get access to all the people we saw die earlier in the series?
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series.
Clara and Danny haven't been going out that long - it's entirely possible she could be pregnant but not visibly so, so a living Danny would no longer be required.
In which episodes have they been seen boinking each other silly?
In what episodes were Rory and Amy seen doing so? Yet River Song existed regardless.
Well, there was specific reference to her and Rory going at it in the
TARDIS. Hence the joke about her baby having a "time head."

But honestly, it was retconned in, I think. I don't remember any
specific scenes of them coming out of a bedroom all out of breath or
anything like that.
Charles E. Hardwidge
2014-11-02 04:50:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Not to mention, how did the Master get access to all the people we saw die earlier in the series?
No idea but Philip Jose framer wrote a series of lucrative books
exploring the idea.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riverworld
--
Charles E. Hardwidge
Adam H. Kerman
2014-11-04 14:27:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@conservation.org
Clara and Danny haven't been going out that long - it's entirely
possible she could be pregnant but not visibly so, so a living Danny
would no longer be required.
That would be horrid, but there is no birth control on tv at all. There's
only the long-time married couple desperate to get pregnant that can't,
then hilarity ensues. Unintended pregnancy as a way to advance the plot
is annoying as hell.
Post by p***@conservation.org
Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
You don't care if the explanation sucks?
Post by p***@conservation.org
Well, that will be the only reason to keep watching, since it was a pretty tedious episode.
p***@conservation.org
2014-11-04 21:28:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by p***@conservation.org
Clara and Danny haven't been going out that long - it's entirely
possible she could be pregnant but not visibly so, so a living Danny
would no longer be required.
That would be horrid,
I already suggested earlier in the season that making it clear Danny and Clara would have offspring was a bad move, since it ruled out using Danny as a possible villain (at least unless Clara also turns out to be a villain), and indeed that she'd have to survive long enough to give birth (and so, if she does leave this year, it won't be by dying).
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by p***@conservation.org
Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
You don't care if the explanation sucks?
That was Aggy's comment - Usenet doesn't quote properly.

Resolutions to 'mysteries' are usually disappointing, which is why it tends to be a bad idea to predicate stories on nothing more than a 'hook' (the problem Moffatt consistently falls into) - a good mystery emerges organically as part of an ongoing story that's compelling in its own right whether or not the mystery is solved, whether it's solved by a set deadline, and whether the resolution to the mystery satisfies.
Ryan P.
2014-11-04 22:15:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@conservation.org
Resolutions to 'mysteries' are usually disappointing, which is why it tends to be a bad idea to predicate stories on nothing more than a 'hook' (the problem Moffatt consistently falls into) - a good mystery emerges organically as part of an ongoing story that's compelling in its own right whether or not the mystery is solved, whether it's solved by a set deadline, and whether the resolution to the mystery satisfies.
Its a problem a LOT of producers fall into, and always has been.
Unfortunately, for the majority of today's TV, even producers that WANT
to get it right don't have the liberty to properly develop a long-term
plot. TV executives think viewers don't have the patience to follow
such a thing. Sadly, the majority of the viewing public probably doesn't.
The Doctor
2014-11-04 22:24:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ryan P.
Post by p***@conservation.org
Resolutions to 'mysteries' are usually disappointing, which is why it tends to be a bad idea to predicate stories on nothing more than a 'hook' (the problem Moffatt consistently falls into) - a good mystery emerges organically as part of an ongoing story that's compelling in its own right whether or not the mystery is solved, whether it's solved by a set deadline, and whether the resolution to the mystery satisfies.
Its a problem a LOT of producers fall into, and always has been.
Unfortunately, for the majority of today's TV, even producers that WANT
to get it right don't have the liberty to properly develop a long-term
plot. TV executives think viewers don't have the patience to follow
such a thing. Sadly, the majority of the viewing public probably doesn't.
Well if there were to do 2 parters and a 3 parter, it would work.

Still the Special I would keep.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
TB
2014-11-02 02:08:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Saturday, November 1, 2014 3:32:10 PM UTC-7, Agamemnon wrote:

1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
Perhaps Danny's love for Clara will enable him to break free of his Cyberman body, like the man who broke free upon hearing his baby son crying a few years ago (Closing Time).
Pudentame
2014-11-02 03:46:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
Perhaps Danny's love for Clara will enable him to break free of his Cyberman body, like the man who broke free upon hearing his baby son crying a few years ago (Closing Time).
Do we know yet that Danny has a Cyberman body already?

It seems like the minds are stored in the Nethersphere until their
emotions have been deleted before they can be downloaded into their
Cyberman bodies.

I'm guessing Danny won't have his emotions deleted until he touches
the delete button on the pad. If he doesn't touch the delete, he can
be rescued/recovered ... maybe.

If he does touch the delete, he's gone for good.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:07:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
Perhaps Danny's love for Clara will enable him to break free of his Cyberman body, like the man who broke free upon hearing his baby son crying a few years ago (Closing Time).
Do we know yet that Danny has a Cyberman body already?
It seems like the minds are stored in the Nethersphere until their
emotions have been deleted before they can be downloaded into their
Cyberman bodies.
I'm guessing Danny won't have his emotions deleted until he touches
the delete button on the pad. If he doesn't touch the delete, he can
be rescued/recovered ... maybe.
If he does touch the delete, he's gone for good.
Cyberised Danny without him knowing he is cyberised.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Your Name
2014-11-02 04:14:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
Perhaps Danny's love for Clara will enable him to break free of his Cyberman
body, like the man who broke free upon hearing his baby son crying a few
years ago (Closing Time).
And plastic-man Rory. :-)
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:16:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
Perhaps Danny's love for Clara will enable him to break free of his Cyberman
body, like the man who broke free upon hearing his baby son crying a few
years ago (Closing Time).
And plastic-man Rory. :-)
First Rory then Danny Pink.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
TB
2014-11-02 02:11:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Spoilers:

1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
I have long wondered if a Time Lord could have a sex change. Now I know. I hereby suggest that the Doctor regenerate as a woman!
Post by Agamemnon
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
The Doctor
2014-11-02 02:22:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
I have long wondered if a Time Lord could have a sex change. Now I know. I hereby suggest that the Doctor regenerate as a woman!
Or a corruptable regeneration.
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
How did the Master / The mistress get away fror the Gallifreyan
Time Wars?

Ag, which Greek hero went into the Underground to rescue
their beloved?
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 03:52:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
I have long wondered if a Time Lord could have a sex change. Now I know.
I hereby suggest that the Doctor regenerate as a woman!
Or a corruptable regeneration.
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
How did the Master / The mistress get away fror the Gallifreyan
Time Wars?
Ag, which Greek hero went into the Underground to rescue
their beloved?
Orpheus.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:09:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by The Doctor
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
I have long wondered if a Time Lord could have a sex change. Now I know.
I hereby suggest that the Doctor regenerate as a woman!
Or a corruptable regeneration.
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
How did the Master / The mistress get away fror the Gallifreyan
Time Wars?
Ag, which Greek hero went into the Underground to rescue
their beloved?
Orpheus.
I was trying to recall that.

The Doctor and Clara were trying to do an Orpheus.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
TB
2014-11-02 02:13:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1

If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he vanish, or keel over dead?
The Doctor
2014-11-02 02:23:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he vanish, or keel over dead?
Right now he is teerocyberised.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Pudentame
2014-11-02 03:49:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 04:27:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at the
end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
Timothy Bruening
2014-11-02 04:45:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1

Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself in the Promised Land.
Timothy Bruening
2014-11-02 04:56:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself in the Promised Land.
If Winston Churchill is in the Netherworld, what will he be doing?
Your Name
2014-11-02 05:38:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Timothy Bruening
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the
future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself
in the Promised Land.
If Winston Churchill is in the Netherworld, what will he be doing?
Smoking a cigar. ;-)
Siri Crews
2014-11-02 06:29:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Timothy Bruening
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the
future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself
in the Promised Land.
If Winston Churchill is in the Netherworld, what will he be doing?
No, no, no. The joke is what is Mozart doing in the Nethersphere.
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'
Icke's razor: Given two equally plausible explanations, choose the weirder.
Defenders of Anarchy.
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 04:56:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the
future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself
in the Promised Land.
That's what was shown to us apparently. The question is how did the Mistress
(stupid name, why couldn't Moffat has just stuch with Master) obtain the
ability to do it. Was he tracking the TARDIS?
Charles E. Hardwidge
2014-11-02 05:05:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
That's what was shown to us apparently. The question is how did the Mistress
(stupid name, why couldn't Moffat has just stuch with Master) obtain the
ability to do it. Was he tracking the TARDIS?
Basically, there's people Moffat couldn't win over no matter how the
character expressed themselves because they've already rigged them to
fail... After your earlier performances over middle-age women having
opinions prolly because you'd utterly shit yourself if a woman wore a
three piece suit and called themselves Mister? otoh, maybe the character
identifies with and is comfortable with gender-normative expression?
Maybe both?
--
Charles E. Hardwidge
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 05:26:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Agamemnon
That's what was shown to us apparently. The question is how did the
Mistress
Post by Agamemnon
(stupid name, why couldn't Moffat has just stuch with Master) obtain the
ability to do it. Was he tracking the TARDIS?
Basically, there's people Moffat couldn't win over no matter how the
character expressed themselves because they've already rigged them to
fail... After your earlier performances over middle-age women having
opinions prolly because you'd utterly shit yourself if a woman wore a
three piece suit and called themselves Mister? otoh, maybe the character
Wouldn't mind Keira Knightly or Cara Delevingne in a suit. Lots of pics on
Google.

Margert Thatcher wore a suit too and she was far worse than the Master in
what she did to this country.
Post by Agamemnon
identifies with and is comfortable with gender-normative expression? Maybe
both?
He probably wants a different toy to play with.

Maybe he was also a woman all the way between Roger Delgado and Peter Pratt
which might explain the reason for the long gap.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:21:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Agamemnon
That's what was shown to us apparently. The question is how did the
Mistress
Post by Agamemnon
(stupid name, why couldn't Moffat has just stuch with Master) obtain the
ability to do it. Was he tracking the TARDIS?
Basically, there's people Moffat couldn't win over no matter how the
character expressed themselves because they've already rigged them to
fail... After your earlier performances over middle-age women having
opinions prolly because you'd utterly shit yourself if a woman wore a
three piece suit and called themselves Mister? otoh, maybe the character
Wouldn't mind Keira Knightly or Cara Delevingne in a suit. Lots of pics on
Google.
Margert Thatcher wore a suit too and she was far worse than the Master in
what she did to this country.
Ugly thought: M Thatcher is back in DW
this time as a cyberwoman.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Agamemnon
identifies with and is comfortable with gender-normative expression? Maybe
both?
He probably wants a different toy to play with.
Maybe he was also a woman all the way between Roger Delgado and Peter Pratt
which might explain the reason for the long gap.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Pudentame
2014-11-02 21:01:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 05:26:57 -0000, "Agamemnon"
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Agamemnon
That's what was shown to us apparently. The question is how did the
Mistress
Post by Agamemnon
(stupid name, why couldn't Moffat has just stuch with Master) obtain the
ability to do it. Was he tracking the TARDIS?
Basically, there's people Moffat couldn't win over no matter how the
character expressed themselves because they've already rigged them to
fail... After your earlier performances over middle-age women having
opinions prolly because you'd utterly shit yourself if a woman wore a
three piece suit and called themselves Mister? otoh, maybe the character
Wouldn't mind Keira Knightly or Cara Delevingne in a suit. Lots of pics on
Google.
Joanna Lumley would be a hoot as "The Mistress", since Steven Moffat
has already had her play "The Doctor".
Daniel47@teranews.com
2014-11-03 09:57:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 02/11/14 16:26, Agamemnon wrote:

<Snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Margert Thatcher wore a suit too and she was far worse than the Master in
what she did to this country.
I don't think Maggie did much damage to this country!!

Daniel
Agamemnon
2014-11-03 19:43:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ***@teranews.com
<Snip>
Post by Agamemnon
Margert Thatcher wore a suit too and she was far worse than the Master in
what she did to this country.
I don't think Maggie did much damage to this country!!
Yes, much is an understatement. She did an overwhelmingly stupendous amount
of damage to this country and it's people.
Post by ***@teranews.com
Daniel
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:19:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the
future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself
in the Promised Land.
That's what was shown to us apparently. The question is how did the Mistress
(stupid name, why couldn't Moffat has just stuch with Master) obtain the
ability to do it. Was he tracking the TARDIS?
He did it in Castrovalva.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Pudentame
2014-11-02 20:47:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 04:56:14 -0000, "Agamemnon"
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the
future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself
in the Promised Land.
That's what was shown to us apparently. The question is how did the Mistress
(stupid name, why couldn't Moffat has just stuch with Master) obtain the
ability to do it. Was he tracking the TARDIS?
Probably. He's been so obsessed with The Doctor that he's done it
before
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:18:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the future, such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself in the Promised Land.
That does come to mind.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Pudentame
2014-11-02 20:45:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sat, 1 Nov 2014 21:45:42 -0700 (PDT), Timothy Bruening
Post by Timothy Bruening
1
Does the Netherworld already contain those people who will die in the future,
such as the soldier who died in "Into the Dalek" and found herself in the
Promised Land.
Nethersphere ... and I would say it does contain those we've seen
Missy collecting.

I don't know that the Nethersphere contains EVERYONE who will die in
the future. We only have Missy's word for it, and just how trustworthy
is that?
solar penguin
2014-11-02 07:12:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at
the end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
I thought everything Danny's experiencing in the Neversphere is just
virtual reality generated on the Gallifreyan hard drive. If most
Gallifreyan tech is anything like the TARDIS, it doesn't always give
people what they want or expect, but what it thinks is most appropriate.
So the Cyberman reflection could be just the hard drive's personal
prediction for him.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:16:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at the
end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
Point very well taken.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Daniel47@teranews.com
2014-11-03 10:04:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at the
end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
Point very well taken.
But didn't Clara "see" a Cyberman in her mirror?? She hasn't become a
Cyberman, yet!! Or was it just us that saw it??

Daniel
Siri Crews
2014-11-03 16:50:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by ***@teranews.com
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
But didn't Clara "see" a Cyberman in her mirror?? She hasn't become a
Cyberman, yet!! Or was it just us that saw it??
Yes. There's one in the room behind her. That's when she runs to the locked
door. End credits.
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'
Icke's razor: Given two equally plausible explanations, choose the weirder.
Defenders of Anarchy.
TB
2014-11-02 16:18:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at the
end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
However, a few minutes before the end of the episode, I saw a reflection of Danny's HUMAN head in the iPad! Given that he was already a Cyberman, why would that be?
Daniel47@teranews.com
2014-11-03 10:05:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at the
end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
However, a few minutes before the end of the episode, I saw a reflection of Danny's HUMAN head in the iPad! Given that he was already a Cyberman, why would that be?
He hasn't pressed the button, yet, has he??

Daniel
Pudentame
2014-11-02 20:38:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 04:27:58 -0000, "Agamemnon"
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at the
end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
Not in the episode I watched.

It's his face reflected & as he's just about to touch delete, he sees
face of the boy from Afghanistan looking over his shoulder.
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 21:16:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 04:27:58 -0000, "Agamemnon"
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
It's already in a Cyberman body. We saw Danny's refection in the iPad at the
end of the episode and it was that of a Cyber head.
Not in the episode I watched.
It's his face reflected & as he's just about to touch delete, he sees
face of the boy from Afghanistan looking over his shoulder.
Just checked my recording. Yes the boy is in there. I originally thought the
reflection to the right of that was a Cyber head because I saw something
that looked like one of the handlebars on the side but is looks like it's
something vertical in the background instead.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:08:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
New idea: Anyone like the St Paul's Cybermen scene
similar to that of the Invasion?
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 21:19:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
New idea: Anyone like the St Paul's Cybermen scene
similar to that of the Invasion?
It was better in the Invasion. Moffat's gone to far with his gimmicks. The
gimmick of a female Master has worn off already.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 21:56:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by The Doctor
Post by Pudentame
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
My guess is his emotions will be deleted & his mind will then ready to
be downloaded into a Cyberman body.
New idea: Anyone like the St Paul's Cybermen scene
similar to that of the Invasion?
It was better in the Invasion. Moffat's gone to far with his gimmicks. The
gimmick of a female Master has worn off already.
Well that SM for you.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 03:52:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
He erases all of his memories and emotions.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:10:34 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
If Danny presses the "Delete" button, what will happen to him? Will he
vanish, or keel over dead?
He erases all of his memories and emotions.
Or himself overall.

Also these are Masterly Terran Cybermen, not Mondasian Cybermen.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
TB
2014-11-02 04:06:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
At the start, Danny is hit by a car while talking to Clara on the phone. It seem to me that Clara should have heard a loud thump when the car hit.

How did Clara find all those keys?
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:13:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
At the start, Danny is hit by a car while talking to Clara on the phone. It seem to me that Clara should have heard a loud thump when the car hit.
Or a car screech!
Post by TB
How did Clara find all those keys?
In her nightmares.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Pudentame
2014-11-02 21:08:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I was also hoping that they really had visited the underworld but it became
all too apparent that this was Stephen Moffat's take on the Big Finish audio
adventure Human Resources also. And why recreate the iconic scene from The
Invasion with the Cybermen walking down the steps of St Paul's Cathedral?
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
Since we saw Danny's reflection and know he's already been turned into a
Cyberman what was all that stuff about his supposed descendent in the future
earlier in the series. Hopefully it will all be explained next week.
10/10
At the start, Danny is hit by a car while talking to Clara on the phone. It seem to me that Clara should have heard a loud thump when the car hit.
How did Clara find all those keys?
She's been with The Doctor for how long? Including having entered The
Doctor's time stream to become the impossible girl?

Plus one of the themes of Series 8 is The Doctor & Clara have lots of
adventures that don't show up in the weekly episodes.
TB
2014-11-02 04:10:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Because she knew that the Doctor would be reluctant to undo Danny's death for fear of evoking a paradox.
The Doctor
2014-11-02 13:15:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Because she knew that the Doctor would be reluctant to undo Danny's death for fear of evoking a paradox.
How does Orson come to being?
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Mike Hall
2014-11-03 22:45:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Because she knew that the Doctor would be reluctant to undo Danny's death for fear of evoking a paradox.
How does Orson come to being?
Clara is clearly pregnant. Danny is dead and I don't think he is going
to do a Rory. He'll just make up for killing the kid in the end.


Mike Hall
Agamemnon
2014-11-04 02:33:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by TB
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Because she knew that the Doctor would be reluctant to undo Danny's
death for fear of evoking a paradox.
How does Orson come to being?
Clara is clearly pregnant. Danny is dead and I don't think he is going to
do a Rory. He'll just make up for killing the kid in the end.
Are the post it notes on the wall some kind of pregnancy callender?
Mike Hall
Siri Crews
2014-11-04 03:52:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Are the post it notes on the wall some kind of pregnancy callender?
While this is a totally foreign concept to usenet, some people like to organise
their thoughts before speaking or write. One system involves index cards (older
version) or post-its (newer) writing out fragments and arranging them and
rearranging and rearranging to make a coherent whole.
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'
Icke's razor: Given two equally plausible explanations, choose the weirder.
Defenders of Anarchy.
Mike M
2014-11-04 06:22:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Siri Crews
Post by Agamemnon
Are the post it notes on the wall some kind of pregnancy callender?
While this is a totally foreign concept to usenet, some people like to organise
their thoughts before speaking or write. One system involves index cards (older
version) or post-its (newer) writing out fragments and arranging them and
rearranging and rearranging to make a coherent whole.
Good luck to anyone who can make Clara's recent escapades into a coherent
whole. Gods know the writers and directors haven't been able to.
--
This space intentionally left blank
Siri Crews
2014-11-02 06:17:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
They aren't dead. The explanation will likely be Missy intervenes moments before
death, putting the body in stasis, appearing to be dead, and uploaded their
mind. Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly different
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional response
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after burial
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conversion.
Post by Agamemnon
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
They are living people.
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'
Icke's razor: Given two equally plausible explanations, choose the weirder.
Defenders of Anarchy.
Agamemnon
2014-11-02 20:34:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Siri Crews
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
They aren't dead. The explanation will likely be Missy intervenes moments before
death, putting the body in stasis, appearing to be dead, and uploaded their
mind.
It's the same technology the Time Lords use in the Deadly Assassin but there
it wasn't done remotely. The body had to be brought for scanning.

The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly different
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional response
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after burial
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conversion.
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was still
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme lengths
to make Cybermen?

Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
Post by Siri Crews
Post by Agamemnon
to have had their bodies already cremated or parts missing) and turning them
into Cybermen? Wouldn't it have bean easier to convert living people or just
copy their mind, why wait until they're dead?
They are living people.
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with their
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his political
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it. Why can't they
feel the embalming fluid burning inside their bodies? Remember that horror
movie or could have been Tales of the Unexpected back in the 70s or early
80s along those lines?
Pudentame
2014-11-02 23:55:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 2 Nov 2014 20:34:17 -0000, "Agamemnon"
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
Post by Agamemnon
Why would anyone want to go to the extreme lengths of harvesting the minds
of the dead, building them a whole new biological skeleton (since some seem
They aren't dead. The explanation will likely be Missy intervenes moments before
death, putting the body in stasis, appearing to be dead, and uploaded their
mind.
It's the same technology the Time Lords use in the Deadly Assassin but there
it wasn't done remotely. The body had to be brought for scanning.
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
It's The Master ... the more convoluted and hairbrained a scheme he
can come up with the happier he ... or I guess now she ... is.
Jack Bohn
2014-11-03 15:36:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
As the previous method involved grabbing resisting and sometimes armed individuals, it's an open question as to whether this is not the easier way.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly different
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional response
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after burial
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conversion.
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was still
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme lengths
to make Cybermen?
Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
Two different parts of the plan. 3W ("Rest in Peace -- We Guarantee") is a current-day or near-future company collecting bodies under the advertizing that the mind/spirit/soul is still connected, and cremation (and, I imagine embalming fluid, which, as Monty Python might say, is still a bit of a shock if you're not quite dead) is felt. The bodies seem to be allowed to naturally decay, which, like walking upright, may still not be easy on us, but which we've gotten used to. In reality, cyber-conversion is taking place on the organic parts. Cybermen are not robots, and cyber...uh...netics is not robotics; all the upgrades start from an organic base. Their programming is not sufficient if the organic brain has decayed; you get something like Handles with little cogitation or motivation. So the Mistress has found a way to infuse the circuitry with a mind -- not copied from the dead body, but collected elsewhere, apparently by following the Doctor from the past of "Deep Breath" to the future of "Inside the Dalek" to the present of "Caretaker". Danny and the policeman from the present seem to be fed the same line as is being advertized by 3W, others may not be.

Wasn't Clara asked what was being done with Danny's body? This may (or may not) be one case where the mind and body are from the same source.
Post by Agamemnon
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with their
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his political
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?
Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit of the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.
--
-Jack
The Doctor
2014-11-03 15:54:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
As the previous method involved grabbing resisting and sometimes armed indi=
viduals, it's an open question as to whether this is not the easier way.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly =
different
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional re=
sponse
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after b=
urial
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conv=
ersion.
Post by Agamemnon
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of=20
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was st=
ill=20
Post by Agamemnon
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme length=
s=20
Post by Agamemnon
to make Cybermen?
=20
Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy=20
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
Two different parts of the plan. 3W ("Rest in Peace -- We Guarantee") is a=
current-day or near-future company collecting bodies under the advertizing=
that the mind/spirit/soul is still connected, and cremation (and, I imagin=
e embalming fluid, which, as Monty Python might say, is still a bit of a sh=
ock if you're not quite dead) is felt. The bodies seem to be allowed to na=
turally decay, which, like walking upright, may still not be easy on us, bu=
t which we've gotten used to. In reality, cyber-conversion is taking place=
on the organic parts. Cybermen are not robots, and cyber...uh...netics is=
not robotics; all the upgrades start from an organic base. Their programm=
ing is not sufficient if the organic brain has decayed; you get something l=
ike Handles with little cogitation or motivation. So the Mistress has foun=
d a way to infuse the circuitry with a mind -- not copied from the dead bod=
y, but collected elsewhere, apparently by following the Doctor from the pas=
t of "Deep Breath" to the future of "Inside the Dalek" to the present of "C=
aretaker". Danny and the policeman from the present seem to be fed the sam=
e line as is being advertized by 3W, others may not be.
Wasn't Clara asked what was being done with Danny's body? This may (or may=
not) be one case where the mind and body are from the same source.
Post by Agamemnon
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous=20
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with th=
eir=20
Post by Agamemnon
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his politic=
al=20
Post by Agamemnon
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?
Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit of =
the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.
--=20
-Jack
Creation for me is a crime. Bury all I say.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Agamemnon
2014-11-03 18:27:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by Agamemnon
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
As the previous method involved grabbing resisting and sometimes armed indi=
viduals, it's an open question as to whether this is not the easier way.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly =
different
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional re=
sponse
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after b=
urial
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conv=
ersion.
Post by Agamemnon
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of=20
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was st=
ill=20
Post by Agamemnon
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme length=
s=20
Post by Agamemnon
to make Cybermen?
=20
Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy=20
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
Two different parts of the plan. 3W ("Rest in Peace -- We Guarantee") is a=
current-day or near-future company collecting bodies under the advertizing=
that the mind/spirit/soul is still connected, and cremation (and, I imagin=
e embalming fluid, which, as Monty Python might say, is still a bit of a sh=
ock if you're not quite dead) is felt. The bodies seem to be allowed to na=
turally decay, which, like walking upright, may still not be easy on us, bu=
t which we've gotten used to. In reality, cyber-conversion is taking place=
on the organic parts. Cybermen are not robots, and cyber...uh...netics is=
not robotics; all the upgrades start from an organic base. Their programm=
ing is not sufficient if the organic brain has decayed; you get something l=
ike Handles with little cogitation or motivation. So the Mistress has foun=
d a way to infuse the circuitry with a mind -- not copied from the dead bod=
y, but collected elsewhere, apparently by following the Doctor from the pas=
t of "Deep Breath" to the future of "Inside the Dalek" to the present of "C=
aretaker". Danny and the policeman from the present seem to be fed the sam=
e line as is being advertized by 3W, others may not be.
Wasn't Clara asked what was being done with Danny's body? This may (or may=
not) be one case where the mind and body are from the same source.
Post by Agamemnon
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous=20
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with th=
eir=20
Post by Agamemnon
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his politic=
al=20
Post by Agamemnon
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?
Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit of =
the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.
--=20
-Jack
Creation for me is a crime. Bury all I say.
Creation is a crime?
The Doctor
2014-11-03 21:39:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
Post by The Doctor
Post by Agamemnon
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
As the previous method involved grabbing resisting and sometimes armed indi=
viduals, it's an open question as to whether this is not the easier way.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly =
different
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional re=
sponse
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after b=
urial
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conv=
ersion.
Post by Agamemnon
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of=20
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was st=
ill=20
Post by Agamemnon
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme length=
s=20
Post by Agamemnon
to make Cybermen?
=20
Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy=20
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
Two different parts of the plan. 3W ("Rest in Peace -- We Guarantee") is a=
current-day or near-future company collecting bodies under the advertizing=
that the mind/spirit/soul is still connected, and cremation (and, I imagin=
e embalming fluid, which, as Monty Python might say, is still a bit of a sh=
ock if you're not quite dead) is felt. The bodies seem to be allowed to na=
turally decay, which, like walking upright, may still not be easy on us, bu=
t which we've gotten used to. In reality, cyber-conversion is taking place=
on the organic parts. Cybermen are not robots, and cyber...uh...netics is=
not robotics; all the upgrades start from an organic base. Their programm=
ing is not sufficient if the organic brain has decayed; you get something l=
ike Handles with little cogitation or motivation. So the Mistress has foun=
d a way to infuse the circuitry with a mind -- not copied from the dead bod=
y, but collected elsewhere, apparently by following the Doctor from the pas=
t of "Deep Breath" to the future of "Inside the Dalek" to the present of "C=
aretaker". Danny and the policeman from the present seem to be fed the sam=
e line as is being advertized by 3W, others may not be.
Wasn't Clara asked what was being done with Danny's body? This may (or may=
not) be one case where the mind and body are from the same source.
Post by Agamemnon
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous=20
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with th=
eir=20
Post by Agamemnon
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his politic=
al=20
Post by Agamemnon
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?
Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit of =
the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.
--=20
-Jack
Creation for me is a crime. Bury all I say.
Creation is a crime?
Not even a spell checker could catch that.

CREMATION is a crime!
^
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Stephen Wilson
2014-11-03 21:59:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Doctor
Post by Agamemnon
Post by The Doctor
Post by Agamemnon
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
As the previous method involved grabbing resisting and sometimes armed indi=
viduals, it's an open question as to whether this is not the easier way.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is
slightly
=
different
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional re=
sponse
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps
after
b=
urial
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conv=
ersion.
Post by Agamemnon
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of=20
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was st=
ill=20
Post by Agamemnon
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme length=
s=20
Post by Agamemnon
to make Cybermen?
=20
Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy=20
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
Two different parts of the plan. 3W ("Rest in Peace -- We Guarantee")
is
a=
current-day or near-future company collecting bodies under the advertizing=
that the mind/spirit/soul is still connected, and cremation (and, I imagin=
e embalming fluid, which, as Monty Python might say, is still a bit of a sh=
ock if you're not quite dead) is felt. The bodies seem to be allowed to na=
turally decay, which, like walking upright, may still not be easy on us, bu=
t which we've gotten used to. In reality, cyber-conversion is taking place=
on the organic parts. Cybermen are not robots, and cyber...uh...netics is=
not robotics; all the upgrades start from an organic base. Their programm=
ing is not sufficient if the organic brain has decayed; you get
something
l=
ike Handles with little cogitation or motivation. So the Mistress has foun=
d a way to infuse the circuitry with a mind -- not copied from the dead bod=
y, but collected elsewhere, apparently by following the Doctor from the pas=
t of "Deep Breath" to the future of "Inside the Dalek" to the present of "C=
aretaker". Danny and the policeman from the present seem to be fed the sam=
e line as is being advertized by 3W, others may not be.
Wasn't Clara asked what was being done with Danny's body? This may (or may=
not) be one case where the mind and body are from the same source.
Post by Agamemnon
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous=20
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord=
=20
Post by Agamemnon
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with th=
eir=20
Post by Agamemnon
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his politic=
al=20
Post by Agamemnon
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?
Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit
of
=
the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.
--=20
-Jack
Creation for me is a crime. Bury all I say.
Creation is a crime?
Not even a spell checker could catch that.
CREMATION is a crime!
^
Not in any country I've ever lived in.
TB
2014-11-03 22:25:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Monday, November 3, 2014 1:39:48 PM UTC-8, The Doctor wrote:

Total munch:

1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
Dear Doctor:

When you enter to Nethersphere, please look up Isaac Asimov and ask him if he's completed the Foundation Series during the 22 plus years he has been in the Nethersphere.
Mike Hall
2014-11-03 23:23:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by TB
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
1
When you enter to Nethersphere, please look up Isaac Asimov and ask him if he's completed the Foundation Series during the 22 plus years he has been in the Nethersphere.
No, I have a feeling that Mr Asimov had nothing more to write save
prequels. Galaxia would be the Borg anyway.


Mike Hall
Agamemnon
2014-11-03 18:26:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
<<<As the previous method involved grabbing resisting and sometimes armed
individuals, it's an open question as to whether this is not the easier
way.>>>

It's still far easier to grab the resisting and armed individuals especially
when they're asleep than resurrecting the dead.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly different
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional response
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after burial
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conversion.
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was still
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme lengths
to make Cybermen?
Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
<<<Two different parts of the plan. 3W ("Rest in Peace -- We Guarantee") is
a current-day or near-future company collecting bodies under the advertizing
that the mind/spirit/soul is still connected, and cremation (and, I imagine
embalming fluid, which, as Monty Python might say, is still a bit of a shock
if you're not quite dead) is felt. The bodies seem to be allowed to
naturally decay, which, like walking upright, may still not be easy on us,
but which we've gotten used to. In reality, cyber-conversion is taking
place on the organic parts. Cybermen are not robots, and
cyber...uh...netics is not robotics; all the upgrades start from an organic
base. Their programming is not sufficient if the organic brain has decayed;
you get something like Handles with little cogitation or motivation. So the
Mistress has found a way to infuse the circuitry with a mind -- not copied
from the dead body, but collected elsewhere, apparently by following the
Doctor from the past of "Deep Breath" to the future of "Inside the Dalek" to
the present of "Caretaker". Danny and the policeman from the present seem
to be fed the same line as is being advertized by 3W, others may not be.>>>

It's totally ridiculous. If you already have the mind uploaded you don't
need anything organic in your Cybermen so why the skeletons or the need for
organic bodies? Cybermen were about getting rid of all of that.

And calling the Master the Mistress only brings the idea of bondage to mind.
Why couldn't Moffat have brought back the Rani or stuck with calling the
Master the Master.

If the Rani is eventually brought back and she regenerates into a man will
she be called the Raja?

And why bring back the Master and have them building Cybermen anyway? Isn't
the Master big enough to hold the story up all by themselves without the
need of additional villains? The same goes for the Cybermen. Can't they hold
the story up all by themselves. Why do they need the Master behind them?

<<<Wasn't Clara asked what was being done with Danny's body? This may (or
may not) be one case where the mind and body are from the same source.>>>
Post by Agamemnon
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with their
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his political
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
<<<?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?>>>

If not Moffat's just opened one.

<<<Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit
of the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.>>>

Even eat them?
solar penguin
2014-11-04 11:55:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
<<<?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?>>>
If not Moffat's just opened one.
No more than he opened a political campaign against WiFi in The Bells Of
St John, or against statues in Blink. Taking ordinary things and making
them seem scary is just what Moffat does. It's one of his gimmicks as a
writer.
Siri Crews
2014-11-04 13:33:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by solar penguin
Post by Agamemnon
<<<?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?>>>
If not Moffat's just opened one.
No more than he opened a political campaign against WiFi in The Bells Of
St John, or against statues in Blink. Taking ordinary things and making
them seem scary is just what Moffat does. It's one of his gimmicks as a
writer.
It's an idea that some other people have used. One episode of Dead Like Me had a
grim reaper not getting to dead person to pull his soul out before the autopsy.
--
:-<> Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. Deleted.
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.'
Icke's razor: Given two equally plausible explanations, choose the weirder.
Defenders of Anarchy.
Jack Bohn
2014-11-04 20:51:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
It's totally ridiculous. If you already have the mind uploaded you don't
need anything organic in your Cybermen so why the skeletons or the need for
organic bodies? Cybermen were about getting rid of all of that.
True, but they don't upload themselves to an android, or robot, or even just virtual existence: it seems the cyber process starts from an organic body.
Post by Agamemnon
And why bring back the Master and have them building Cybermen anyway? Isn't
the Master big enough to hold the story up all by themselves without the
need of additional villains? The same goes for the Cybermen. Can't they hold
the story up all by themselves. Why do they need the Master behind them?
I don't know the impetus of the story, presumably it came from wanting Danny dead, at least temporarily. The Master raising an army of the dead is either black magic or technomagic; they'd always choose the latter, so he has to get his tech from somewhere. Other races have been created to be his catspaws before, here they chose an existing one.
Post by Agamemnon
Post by Agamemnon
The stuff about it being connected with their
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his political
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
<<<?!?
Is there a political agenda against cremation?>>>
If not Moffat's just opened one.
<<<Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit
of the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.>>>
Even eat them?
If you want to eat your body, you would be ill-advised.
If you want to donate your meat to others... I'm not aware of any actual laws against it, but I haven't checked. You can donate -but not sell- your organs and blood to others for use in their original purposes.
--
-Jack
Ryan P.
2014-11-04 22:55:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Jack Bohn
If you want to eat your body, you would be ill-advised.
If you want to donate your meat to others... I'm not aware of any actual laws against it, but I haven't checked. You can donate -but not sell- your organs and blood to others for use in their original purposes.
In the US, at least, there's there are no laws against it
specifically... But I would think, as suggested by a lot of the top
hits in Google on the subject, that if the authorities wanted to, they
could probably get somebody on mutilating a corpse charges.
The Doctor
2014-11-04 23:35:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
New slogan:

The MAster wants your dead body for his cyberarmy.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
It seems everyone is a believer, after their own understanding. -unknown
p***@conservation.org
2014-11-03 19:04:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I'd be surprised if we get an explanation for that beyond the "I found a way to come back" line we already got - much like his resurrection in series 3 or the Daleks' unexplained survival at the start of Victory of the Daleks, it's just waved away as a plot convenience - at least, unless Moffatt wants to give the Doctor a Clue about where to find Gallifrey.
Stephen Wilson
2014-11-03 20:42:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I'd be surprised if we get an explanation for that beyond the "I found a
way to
come back" line we already got - much like his resurrection in series 3 or
the
Daleks' unexplained survival at the start of Victory of the Daleks, it's
just waved
away as a plot convenience - at least, unless Moffatt wants to give the
Doctor
a Clue about where to find Gallifrey.
It's Moffat having a little fun with the fans again. There was much
speculation about casting a woman to play the Doctor. He didn't go that far,
but he's done it to the Master. Potentially meaning that all bets are now
off when it's time to replace Capaldi...
Mike M
2014-11-03 22:19:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Stephen Wilson
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I'd be surprised if we get an explanation for that beyond the "I found a
way to
come back" line we already got - much like his resurrection in series 3 or
the
Daleks' unexplained survival at the start of Victory of the Daleks, it's
just waved
away as a plot convenience - at least, unless Moffatt wants to give the
Doctor
a Clue about where to find Gallifrey.
It's Moffat having a little fun with the fans again. There was much
speculation about casting a woman to play the Doctor. He didn't go that far,
but he's done it to the Master. Potentially meaning that all bets are now
off when it's time to replace Capaldi...
My money's on Whoopi Goldberg.
--
This space intentionally left blank
The Doctor
2014-11-03 22:32:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Mike M
Post by Stephen Wilson
Post by p***@conservation.org
Post by Agamemnon
New Master... don't like her.
So the beginning was Stephen Moffat's take on Father's Day. Another of RTD's
ideas he's gone and pinched for this series to add to the list.
Why didn't Clara just ask the Doctor nicely to save Danny's life instead of
trying to blackmail him?
Was he actually so distracted by talking to Clara that he actually walked in
front of a car or was he trying to commit suicide? The way it was filmed
didn't look very convincing.
The trailer gave half the plot away and it was either the Rani or the Master
to be the villain. I was hoping for the Rani but knowing what Moffat's like
it was more likely to be the Master especially with a name like Missy.
So how did he/she escape from Gallifray and steal a Time Lord hard drive and
probably a whole load of other scuff as well? Personal teleporter? Travelled
back in time to before the Time War?
I'd be surprised if we get an explanation for that beyond the "I found a
way to
come back" line we already got - much like his resurrection in series 3 or
the
Daleks' unexplained survival at the start of Victory of the Daleks, it's
just waved
away as a plot convenience - at least, unless Moffatt wants to give the
Doctor
a Clue about where to find Gallifrey.
It's Moffat having a little fun with the fans again. There was much
speculation about casting a woman to play the Doctor. He didn't go that far,
but he's done it to the Master. Potentially meaning that all bets are now
off when it's time to replace Capaldi...
My money's on Whoopi Goldberg.
--
This space intentionally left blank
Next actor please.
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca Ici doctor@@nl2k.ab.ca
God,Queen and country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
http://www.fullyfollow.me/rootnl2k Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism
You have not converted a man because you have silenced him. -John Viscount Morley
Loading...