Post by Agamemnon
The question remains why go to such lengths to make Cybermen?
<<<As the previous method involved grabbing resisting and sometimes armed
individuals, it's an open question as to whether this is not the easier
It's still far easier to grab the resisting and armed individuals especially
when they're asleep than resurrecting the dead.
Post by Agamemnon Post by Siri Crews
Cyberman are part replacing body parts with machinery except the brain,
and part destroying emotional responses in the brain. This is slightly different
technique were the mind is tricked into destroying its own emotional response
(Danny facing his Delete button); the body is retrieved perhaps after burial
(hence the importance of not cremating or dissecting) for cyberman conversion.
The explanation was that the sampled mind still had a connection with the
dead body after death and could feel the cold and also the heat of
cremation, and some even had to go though the pain because their body was
not recovered in time. Even with the body turned to ashes the mind was still
on the system so the question still remains why go to such extreme lengths
to make Cybermen?
Is Moffat insinuating that every soul of every dead person in histoy
including Steve Jobs has been or is going to be turned into a Cyberman?
<<<Two different parts of the plan. 3W ("Rest in Peace -- We Guarantee") is
a current-day or near-future company collecting bodies under the advertizing
that the mind/spirit/soul is still connected, and cremation (and, I imagine
embalming fluid, which, as Monty Python might say, is still a bit of a shock
if you're not quite dead) is felt. The bodies seem to be allowed to
naturally decay, which, like walking upright, may still not be easy on us,
but which we've gotten used to. In reality, cyber-conversion is taking
place on the organic parts. Cybermen are not robots, and
cyber...uh...netics is not robotics; all the upgrades start from an organic
base. Their programming is not sufficient if the organic brain has decayed;
you get something like Handles with little cogitation or motivation. So the
Mistress has found a way to infuse the circuitry with a mind -- not copied
from the dead body, but collected elsewhere, apparently by following the
Doctor from the past of "Deep Breath" to the future of "Inside the Dalek" to
the present of "Caretaker". Danny and the policeman from the present seem
to be fed the same line as is being advertized by 3W, others may not be.>>>
It's totally ridiculous. If you already have the mind uploaded you don't
need anything organic in your Cybermen so why the skeletons or the need for
organic bodies? Cybermen were about getting rid of all of that.
And calling the Master the Mistress only brings the idea of bondage to mind.
Why couldn't Moffat have brought back the Rani or stuck with calling the
Master the Master.
If the Rani is eventually brought back and she regenerates into a man will
she be called the Raja?
And why bring back the Master and have them building Cybermen anyway? Isn't
the Master big enough to hold the story up all by themselves without the
need of additional villains? The same goes for the Cybermen. Can't they hold
the story up all by themselves. Why do they need the Master behind them?
<<<Wasn't Clara asked what was being done with Danny's body? This may (or
may not) be one case where the mind and body are from the same source.>>>
Post by Agamemnon
They are not living. They died. They're minds were copied. The nervous
system has all been destroyed. Only their "sprit" survives on a Time Lord
SSD copied before brain death. The stuff about it being connected with their
body is complete nonsense which Moffat inserted in pursuit of his political
agenda against cremation and to scare people who opt for it.
Is there a political agenda against cremation?>>>
If not Moffat's just opened one.
<<<Here in the US, "free to do what we want with our bodies" is the spirit
of the times. This would seem to be the ultimate case.>>>
Even eat them?